product review needed...before I try it myself has anyone else?

Grim_Traveller
on 9/15/15 8:44 am
RNY on 08/21/12

Yeah, it's a complete myth.

6'3" tall, male.

Highest weight was 475. RNY on 08/21/12. Current weight: 198.

M1 -24; M2 -21; M3 -19; M4 -21; M5 -13; M6 -21; M7 -10; M8 -16; M9 -10; M10 -8; M11 -6; M12 -5.

ChristineB
on 9/15/15 4:50 pm - Western 'Burbs Chgo, IL
On September 15, 2015 at 8:44 AM Pacific Time, Grim Traveller, Boy Hag wrote:

Yeah, it's a complete myth.

Would you kindly post the link where you are saying that the ASMBS says this is a myth . . .

 

I find where they mention in the Life after Bariatric Surgery about taking in 60-100gm of protein in the course of a daily ingestion for a PO patient. But this does not address the situation of ingesting 50gm at one time. Please review the fourth question in the Q & A. 

Thank you so much for your time.

 
Open RNY May 7
260/155/140 




 

Grim_Traveller
on 9/15/15 6:59 pm
RNY on 08/21/12

Saying you can only absorb so much protein at one time is a really simplistic statement to a really complicated issue. The myth started because of a couple of studies that measured how much protein it took to affect muscle growth after intense workouts, and they came up with the 30 gram "rule." But those were limited, short-duration, half-assed studies, based on weightlifters.

Protein is not all made the same. There are a whole bunch of scientific measurements that seek to examine the complexity of protein. There is the Protein Digestibility Corrected Amino Acid Score (PDCAAS). This gauges the amount of amino acids in different foods, how much of all the amino acids humans need, and how much of those amino acids in that food we can actually digest. The score goes from 0 to 1.0. Egg whites, milk protein and others are a 1.0, beef is about .95, whole wheat protein is less than .50 All protein is not equal.

Then there is digestibilty alone. Eggs and dairy score 97%, meaning about 3 percent of the protein in those things are NOT digested. Meat is 94%, and soybeans are 78%. I've seen scores for collagen protein, the kind found in some of those icky shots that say they have 40 grams of protein or so, that have digestibility and utilization scores in the single digits. There are lots of other measurements for protein quality, and how well it is absorbed by your average human. There is the Biological Value (BV), Net Protein Utilization (NPU), Protein Efficiency Ratio (PER), among others.

Then there is speed of digestion, which is especially important for your question. Most proteins take about an hour to enter the bloodstream. How fast they spike, and how long they raise levels in your blood, differ widely. Take protein powders, for instance. Whey protein isolate has very quick digestibility, peaking in the blood at the two hour mark, and drops pretty quick after that. Casein and milk protein powders take slightly longer to peak, peak lower, but keep blood protein levels raised for 7 to 8 hours. For that reason, some protein powders are blends of whey, egg, and casein protein, so you get a combination of quick and prolonged benefits. Protein from eggs is absorbed at about 2.9 grams per hour, soy protein is 3.9 grams per hour, and whey and beef are absorbed at 8-10 grams per hour. I'm sure you can see the differences all of these would have on your body.

So, protein is really complex. It's not simply used to make skeletal muscle, which is where 30 gram maximum myth came from. Protein does many, many other things. Amino acids, which are the building blocks of protein, are used to make and grow hair, and fingernails. They are used for other muscles, besides biceps -- muscles like your heart.

If you are on a low carb diet, protein is synthesized into glycogen, which is used by stuff like your brain, and for the energy that isn't coming from carbs. The bonus is, those transformations require energy to turn protein into fuel, while carbs don't. more energy burned, yay!

Amino acids are used for making hormones, enzymes, and all sorts of other things. Your muscles actually get LAST dibs on amino acids, not the first. If you aren't eating enough protein, your hair and nails will suffer, and your body will take it FROM your muscles to supply all these other essential needs.

And for us, the dense protein rule is intended to keep us full and satisfied so we eat less frequently. It really has nothing to do with how much our bodies require.

So, eat as much protein as you want. It's used for much more than muscles, and your body will find a use for ALL of it.

 

6'3" tall, male.

Highest weight was 475. RNY on 08/21/12. Current weight: 198.

M1 -24; M2 -21; M3 -19; M4 -21; M5 -13; M6 -21; M7 -10; M8 -16; M9 -10; M10 -8; M11 -6; M12 -5.

Grim_Traveller
on 9/15/15 7:12 pm
RNY on 08/21/12

What they say, exactly, is:

"During the early postoperative period, incorporating liquid supplements into the patient's daily oral intake provides an important source of calories and protein that help prevent the loss of lean body mass. . . .  One popular myth is that only 30 g/hr of protein can be absorbed. Although this is commonly found in both lay and some professional literature, there is no scientific basis for this claim."

You can find the full text of the report many places online, including: http://www.soard.org/article/S1550-7289%2808%2900163-9/fullt ext

And:

https://asmbs.org/resources/integrated-health-nutritional-gu idelines You'll need to search the page with your browser. Look for the word "myth."

 

6'3" tall, male.

Highest weight was 475. RNY on 08/21/12. Current weight: 198.

M1 -24; M2 -21; M3 -19; M4 -21; M5 -13; M6 -21; M7 -10; M8 -16; M9 -10; M10 -8; M11 -6; M12 -5.

lynnc99
on 9/14/15 3:04 pm

Collagen protein is what most protein "shots" contain and we cannot benefit from this type of protein. Essentially collagen protein is similar to gelatin, made of the beef "by products". 

Whey is a better choice for us. 

Here is a comparison:

http://seannal.com/articles/supplementation/truth-about-beef-protein-isolate-powder.php

Grim_Traveller
on 9/14/15 3:47 pm
RNY on 08/21/12

Yeah, it's crappy collagen protein, like hooves and such. They add the amino acids because collagen is missing those naturally. The bioavailability on collagen is crap compared to whey protein, eggs, or real beef.

I don't know anyone who has tried this particular brand, but everyone who has tried to drink the shots from other manufacturers say they are the nastiest things ever.

6'3" tall, male.

Highest weight was 475. RNY on 08/21/12. Current weight: 198.

M1 -24; M2 -21; M3 -19; M4 -21; M5 -13; M6 -21; M7 -10; M8 -16; M9 -10; M10 -8; M11 -6; M12 -5.

selhard
on 9/15/15 5:16 am - MN
RNY on 11/26/12

My post-op instructions say the most absorbable protein is 100% whey protein isolate.  It also states to stop using protein powders after six months and get protein from dense protein foods after that.  I have chosen to continue on with protein powder use in my morning, homemade protein smoothie.  I use the brand UNJURY but might try another whey protein isolate powder under the brand name NOW.  

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